Man that you fear video

[Zimzum69]

In the video Man that You Fear, at one part Manson walks by a Bus that has some writing on it. I think it says,"Last as Holy of God." Does anyone know what it means?

[Hazekiah]

I'd always read it as "Trust as well of God" (if I'm rememberin' correctly...my TV's on the fritz)...but I've never really seen an exceptionally clear screen capture by which to judge what's actually written.

*ahem*

Hint, hint...anyone?

[pyrox02]

This thread is totally in the wrong section, you know.

[Zimzum69]

meh:-/

[Gaze of sorrow]

evidanced by screen captures from my dvd, it is "cast as holy of god". i am sure. and i have proof, but i dont wanna go to the trouble of proving it unless someone asks me to

[Hazekiah]

Well then, I'm yer man. Like I said, I'm not entirely certain of my take, and I've never really had that good a look at it.

So, by all means, please submit all proof.

:)

[blackrainbown]

Gaze is right in my humble opinion. Looky look at the attached picture.

[profane]

Very interesting. Never took notice to that and thanks for the capture, blackrainbown :)

I'm moving to Interpretations forum.

[Hazekiah]

Oh, yeah...I was definitely mostly wrong there, thanks for the proof, blackrainbown, that clears it up fairly nicely. :)

Hmm, that's interesting. Anyone know any higher esoteric value for the phrase?

Right now, off the top of my head, I'm thinkin' of the casting of stones as a god-sanctioned act, in direct opposition to the Christian teaching of "let he who is without sin cast the first stone" and all that.

Interestingly, the Manson Family-esque bus-text seems to echo/anticipate the whole idea of "christ in the metal shell," too...the delivery of divinity through the instrument of martyrdom in "The Lamb of God," for instance, herein represented by the status of martyrdom Manson attains at the end of the "MTYF" vid by the cast stones (filling in for the fired bullets).

In that sense, of course, rather than the phrase implying the throwers of the stones as being "holy of god," it would instead seem to imply that what is being cast, the stones, would be "holy of god."

Just some initial thoughts...I'll sleep on this one, I guess. Thanks again for settin' me straight. :)

[deftones_chino]

its one of my favorite videos

[controlledchaos]

Originally posted by Hazekiah
Oh, yeah...I was definitely mostly wrong there, thanks for the proof, blackrainbown, that clears it up fairly nicely. :)

Hmm, that's interesting. Anyone know any higher esoteric value for the phrase?

Right now, off the top of my head, I'm thinkin' of the casting of stones as a god-sanctioned act, in direct opposition to the Christian teaching of "let he who is without sin cast the first stone" and all that.

Interestingly, the Manson Family-esque bus-text seems to echo/anticipate the whole idea of "christ in the metal shell," too...the delivery of divinity through the instrument of martyrdom in "The Lamb of God," for instance, herein represented by the status of martyrdom Manson attains at the end of the "MTYF" vid by the cast stones (filling in for the fired bullets).

In that sense, of course, rather than the phrase implying the throwers of the stones as being "holy of god," it would instead seem to imply that what is being cast, the stones, would be "holy of god."

Just some initial thoughts...I'll sleep on this one, I guess. Thanks again for settin' me straight. :)

I like your analysis Haz...and I also feel it's referring to the stones themselves as being "holy of god". It's also a direct reference to the story this video was based on, "The Lottery" by Shirley Jackson. The casting of stones is an intregal part of this story. The story shows how illogical man can be in blind acceptance of what's fed to him, and this applies to all walks of life (religion, politics, social values) . I highly recommend the story...

http://www.americanliterature.com/SS/SS16.HTML

[Calypso]

Hmm... well, whenever I've watched the video I get a certain 'Jesus' vibe- it seems to be a reenactment of 'the ultimate sacrifice', and has several biblical allusions (eg, Jesus falls on the way to the crucifixition). To me, the song and the video demonstrate the role of the scapegoat. But, like all of Manson's work, the song and video are multi-faceted, and many meanings and sources may be drawn from it.

[the_nihilist]

We read this story in school "The Lottery" it is almost exactly like this video. What happens is theres a twist, theres a lottery and who ever wins it gets stoned to death. It takes place in an isolated town, you see people picck up stones in both short story and video. Has anybody read the lottery?

[Zimzum69]

I did........ but I totally forgot about it. I ddnt think it had to do anything with the video.

[the_nihilist]

I doubt it does, but I see a lot of similiarities...the girl at the beginning is like a lotery....whoever she points to dies. Theres a twist in both, you get clues in both...just something I noticed. Both are stoned at the end but doesn't show/describe actual stoning.

[Komaschwarz]

Originally posted by the_nihilist
We read this story in school "The Lottery" it is almost exactly like this video. What happens is theres a twist, theres a lottery and who ever wins it gets stoned to death. It takes place in an isolated town, you see people picck up stones in both short story and video. Has anybody read the lottery?

People incorrectly think this video is based off of that. It isn't.

The stoning is biblical, the adorned hair is biblical, the embalming of the feet is biblical, the single fall while walking is biblical, the shape Manson makes before getting stoned is biblical...I could go on, but that's a good start. Safe to say, there is far more religious background behind this song than to 'The Lottery', which I think only has vague connections with this video.

[TERROJA]

I don't know what it means, but I think the way that we could figure out what it means, if anything--for the origins of that bus are certainly unknown to us and Manson may have included it simply because it puzzled him as well--is to study the grammar of it, which is extremely awkward, and bear in mind all the different meanings of the word "cast".

[Nicolae]

I just farted and it smells like cheetos.

Want some?

[chemist80]

That's definitely one of my favorite videos. It makes me think of a book I read called "Harvest Home." In that book, there's actually a little blonde girl who picks a guy to be the "harvest lord," and who will eventually be sacrificed. I'm sure there's no real connection between the video and that book, but that's what I thought of the first time I saw it, and I still remember that association everytime I watch it.

[Calypso]

Originally posted by the_nihilist
We read this story in school "The Lottery" it is almost exactly like this video. What happens is theres a twist, theres a lottery and who ever wins it gets stoned to death. It takes place in an isolated town, you see people picck up stones in both short story and video. Has anybody read the lottery?

In our library, "The Lottery" is located in the Young Adult Fiction section. I highly doubt that one as well read as Manson would resort to a novel meant for tweens and young teens. :P

I honestly view the video as being derived from the bible.

[Komaschwarz]

Originally posted by Komaschwarz


The stoning is biblical, the adorned hair is biblical, the embalming of the feet is biblical, the single fall while walking is biblical, the shape Manson makes before getting stoned is biblical...

[Komaschwarz]

And even with that short story, there is still only a few similarities to the video, and many of them are slightly off.

However, the biblical references happened exactly as they are written in the bible.

Thus, I still stand by the fact that the bible serves as a better point of refference, then this short story, from everything from accuracy of the text written, to context, to themeatically.

[Hellonheels]

I agree with Arch Dandy. I see no reason why he can't have drawn lines between "Lottery" and the Bible, and created this video from what came of that. Perhaps he read "The Lottery" and saw where Biblical connections could be made.
It is what it is. Behold, or fucking sit down.
N

[Zimzum69]

*finishing hellonheels quote*
"OR I'LL KICK YOU IN THE BALLS"
:-)

[controlledchaos]

Originally posted by Komaschwarz
People incorrectly think this video is based off of that. It isn't.

The stoning is biblical, the adorned hair is biblical, the embalming of the feet is biblical, the single fall while walking is biblical, the shape Manson makes before getting stoned is biblical...I could go on, but that's a good start. Safe to say, there is far more religious background behind this song than to 'The Lottery', which I think only has vague connections with this video.

Why limit yourself to one interpretation of a video? Are you that closed minded? I can clearly see the religious imagery in the video as well, and it's pretty obvious to most people who have half a brain. "The Lottery", and I'm sure many other stories, have storylines very similar to the storyline for the MTYF video. "The Lottery" itself has a religious tone because the people are obeying a law that has been set forth and followed for many years, it's called "blind acceptance" and that's how most people follow religion. The bottom line is that there were probably many inspirations for Manson in this video.

[Hazekiah]

Furthermore, I'm next to goddamned positive that Manson was asked about it and said himself that the video was his take on "The Lottery."

*starts diggin' through magazines, index cards, and the 'phant interview archives*

Race me to the citation?

[Zimzum69]

ooooooh. BURN... Jk. well i bet the lottery has to do with the vid alot. But i also believe that it has many other inspirations.

[the_nihilist]

I see what Komaschwartz is saying, it probably has more to do with the Bible than the lottery, I was just maing some parallels between the two....stories?

[Zimzum69]

I smell Cheetos

[David Alexander]

I also saw in the HolyBlood movie , in the funeral's march , something similar of the last march of the Antichrist in the Man that you fear video , even the dark dancing young girl ...

[bjornwad]

Originally posted by Zimzum69
a Bus that has some writing on it. I think it says,"Last as Holy of God."
http://mansonusa.com/council/attachment.php?s=&postid=365641 Look closer, it says "Last Assembly of God." This seems like a one-off from the normal church denomination "First Assembly of God"

[TERROJA]

Originally posted by bjornwad
Look closer, it says "Last Assembly of God." This seems like a one-off from the normal church denomination "First Assembly of God"

Holy fuck. You actually figured something out. You! HAHAHA!

[bjornwad]

Originally posted by TERROJA
Holy fuck. You actually figured something out. You! HAHAHA! lol thanks ya jerk :p

[TheBurk]

Originally posted by TERROJA
Holy fuck. You actually figured something out. You! HAHAHA!

i think hell just froze over.

[Gen Appithy]

Originally posted by Calypso
In our library, "The Lottery" is located in the Young Adult Fiction section. I highly doubt that one as well read as Manson would resort to a novel meant for tweens and young teens. :P

I honestly view the video as being derived from the bible.

"the lottery" was first published in the New Yorker (1948). it is an american classic. it was hardly ment for teens and tweens

"The Lottery" shows how society blindly follows tradition, even if the event has no current relevance.

""Social Evil: The Lottery," a chapter in Lenemaja Friedman's critical study, Shirley Jackson (Twayne, 1975), summarizes the history of sacrificial situations:

One of the ancient practices that modern man deplores as inhumanly evil is the annual sacrifice of a scapegoat or a god-figure for the benefit of the community. Throughout the ages, from ancient Rome and Greece to the more recent occurrences in African countries, sacrifices in the name of a god of vegetation were usual and necessary, the natives felt, for a fertile crop. Somewhere along the way, the sacrifice of a human for the sins of the people—to drive evil from themselves—became linked with the ritual of the vegetation god. In Mexico, among the Aztecs, the victims impersonated the particular gods for a one-year period before being put to death; death came then by the thrust of a knife into the breast and the immediate extraction of the heart. In Athens, each year in May, at the festival of the Thargelia, two victims, a man and a woman, were led out of the city and stoned to death. Death by stoning was one of the accepted and more popular methods of dispatching ceremonial victims. "

manson has explicitly said he was inspired by "the lottery" for the video

[antichristangel]

if anyone cares, the video where manson references "The Lottery" is right here-
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ty5rOpGy6qk

[bjornwad]

Originally posted by bjornwad
Look closer, it says "Last Assembly of God." This seems like a one-off from the normal church denomination "First Assembly of God"

[bjornwad]

Originally posted by Mothrefucker#1
the `SEM´ in assembly is missing
http://cfweb.cc.ysu.edu/sacredlandmarks/images_trumbull_500/Belmont Ave 6779 First Assembly of God of Girard 2_500.jpg

http://home.att.net/~st.nicholas.indy/pics/bus.jpg

http://turnerstreetbaptistchurch.50megs.com/images/bus.jpg

look, it's a church bus, alright? some of the letters have peeled off, like they always do. It may be a reference to the Carrollton Bus Accident.

On May 14, 1988, a youth group and 4 adults from First Assembly of God in Radcliff, Kentucky boarded their church activity bus and headed to Kings Island theme park (near Cincinnati, Ohio, about 170 miles from Radcliff). The group included church members and their invited guests. As everyone showed up early that Saturday morning, those wanting to go on the trip had grown to more than originally anticipated. The church's principal pastor (who stayed behind) restricted the ridership to the legal limit of 66 persons plus the driver.

The bus collision at Carrollton, Kentucky on May 14, 1988 was one of the most disastrous bus accidents in United States history. A drunk driver traveling the wrong way on an interstate highway collided head-on with a school bus which was in use as church bus. The initial crash was exacerbated by the bus catching fire and difficulties encountered by the occupants attempting to evacuate the crowded bus in the smoke and darkness. The fire killed 27 people and injured 34 of 67 persons on the bus. Only 6 bus passengers escaped significant injury or death. The drunk driver of the pickup truck sustained only minor injuries.

In the aftermath of the tragedy, standards for drinking drivers and for both operation and equipment for school buses and similar non-school buses were improved in Kentucky and many other states. Several parents of victims became active leaders of Mothers Against Drunk Driving (MADD), and one became national president. The crash site is marked with a highway sign erected by the Kentucky Transportation Cabinet (KYTC). Even eighteen years later, memorial items such as crosses and flower arrangements continue to be placed at the site by families and friends.

As of April 2006, the crash remains the worst bus crash in U.S. history.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bus_accident_at_Carrollton,_Kentucky_in_1988

[guillaume]

a little off-topic maybe, but some of you were discussing the inspiration on this video and there are a lot people who die by rocks in the Bible but a few weeks ago I found this passage and I thought it was definitly more interesting:


The Rebellious Son

18 “If a man has a stubborn and rebellious son who will not obey the voice of his father or the voice of his mother, and who, when they have chastened him, will not heed them,

19 then his father and his mother shall take hold of him and bring him out to the elders of his city, to the gate of his city.


20 And they shall say to the elders of his city, ‘This son of ours is stubborn and rebellious; he will not obey our voice; he is a glutton and a drunkard.’


21 Then all the men of his city shall stone him to death with stones; so you shall put away the evil from among you, and all Israel shall hear and fear.





Deuteronomy 21

[bjornwad]

yeah my parents made me read that once :p

[TheBurk]

Originally posted by Mothrefucker#1
the `SEM´ in assembly is missing

nope for once bjorn is right.

[ProdigyOfIcarus]

I accidentally clicked on the I&A section and saw this thread. I always meant to post something about it, but I'm a lazy fucker.

I might be drawing unnecessary conclusions, but image-wise, it looks a LOT like the funeral scene in Godfather 2. Not saying there's any particular reason or deeper meaning behind it, but there's a visual parallel.

*waits for the flaming in regards to how ignorant I am and how "untrue" my connection is and how I shouldn't be allowed to listen to Manson*

[Norsefire]

I was watching the god father this monring, and thsi bit where they get married, is proper like man that you fear video, where theres a band playing and the people follow them to where they dance,
And theres a guy in a wheel chair someones pushing him and they got black umbrellas.

[Hazekiah]

Originally posted by bjornwad
In the aftermath of the tragedy, standards for drinking drivers....were improved in Kentucky and many other states.
I'm just curious...exactly how did they accomplish that? Drunk Driving Only lanes?

:P