I was reading through a thread posted by The King in which he requested people's theories on what The Love Song is about (which no one really answered, lol). Anyways, he mentioned something that caught my attention:
Originally posted by The King
Yes, he created the story of Coma, and Adam, and the whole bullshit tryptych or what have you, but the story is a typical tragic love stroy.
Coma and Adam, Valentine, or what have you, but he could've made something else like....
I know and love the songs about these characters, but I know nothing about the characters themselves. Actually, it really bugs me but as hard as I try, I can not be analytical. So if anyone could tell me anything about Adam, Coma, and/or Valentine, I would deeply appreciate it.
...or just anything you now about these songs: Coma White, Coma Black, Valentine's Day, The Fall of Adam, The Love Song.
Thanks, friends.
The King
11-26-2004, 03:29 AM
Everytime I come across something that has to do with those characters I wonder the same thing, but you would think after as many threads I have read I would understand, But I don't. lol
I don't know how Valentine got thrown up into the deal between coma and adam and all the interpretations I have seen this far have just drew the blank longer in my mind. lol
TimothySkold6
11-26-2004, 02:55 PM
Could Valentine be Adams love in Holy Wood, where Omega's(Alien's) love was Coma White in Mechanical Animals
I don't know about ACS
Mr_Hollywood
11-26-2004, 09:57 PM
What the hell? I never even knew about this third character, Valentine. Where was he/she/it mentioned?
Coma Black and Coma White, in my point of view, are not the same characters.
Coma Black is Adam's first love, the love that he had an infatuation with and was able to get with. Throughout the course of HW, Adam discovers that she is not all that he thought she was. She was a psychopath, a person who was already on edge. I think she commits suicide ("Her hearts a bloodstained egg/ we didn't handle with care/ its broken and bleeding/ and we can never repair") and the way she looks after she dies ("She was the color of tv")
Coma White on the other hand was a love he found when he finally entered Holywood. Abusive, hardheaded, drug addicted, and beautiful, this was the love that Adam, who's now Omega, thought to be perfect, much better than Black, so perfect in fact that he doesn't feel that he is good enough for her. The fate of Coma White is still unknown to me, although i think she died, and The Boy from ACSS kept the bodies of Coma Black and White and created a fake lover, one made of hair and bone and little teeth, spine is just a string(to attach the body parts with).
Ian_Ball
11-26-2004, 10:27 PM
As far as I understood things...I may be wrong here, but...from the only chapter released from the "Holywood" novel, Coma was president White's "daughter". Valentine was the vice president.
That was my take.
SamuraiKoala32
11-27-2004, 06:49 PM
Originally posted by Mr_Hollywood
What the hell? I never even knew about this third character, Valentine. Where was he/she/it mentioned?
Coma Black and Coma White, in my point of view, are not the same characters.
Coma Black is Adam's first love, the love that he had an infatuation with and was able to get with. Throughout the course of HW, Adam discovers that she is not all that he thought she was. She was a psychopath, a person who was already on edge. I think she commits suicide ("Her hearts a bloodstained egg/ we didn't handle with care/ its broken and bleeding/ and we can never repair") and the way she looks after she dies ("She was the color of tv")
Coma White on the other hand was a love he found when he finally entered Holywood. Abusive, hardheaded, drug addicted, and beautiful, this was the love that Adam, who's now Omega, thought to be perfect, much better than Black, so perfect in fact that he doesn't feel that he is good enough for her. The fate of Coma White is still unknown to me, although i think she died, and The Boy from ACSS kept the bodies of Coma Black and White and created a fake lover, one made of hair and bone and little teeth, spine is just a string(to attach the body parts with).
I've never heard of Valentine till just the other day, actually. Perhaps that was a misunderstanding then.
i have an idea of what i think is going on, but i'm still totally open-minded. i think mechanical animals is the past, holy wood present, and antichrist superstar is the future. this is what i got out of it...
MA (past): omega lands on earth and is overwhelmed with this perfect world. he falls in love with a person he calls coma white and is disgusted with the fact that she takes drugs.
HW (present): coma white ODs and dies and omega is devestated and upset with god for taking his angel away.
ACSS (future): a war against god is created.
that storyline has sooo many holes though, so it can't be right. i'm trying though. anyways, how does adam become omega?
Coma_Black_8
11-28-2004, 01:54 AM
How come so many people don't know there's a character named Valentine?
Read chaper 10 of Holywood, Which can be found on this site.
Also....I don't think any interpretation is wrong. The trilogy is meant to be a question mark, Because it is art. No one knows everything, No one knows the entire story.
I think every answer is right. Even the ones that contradict themselves, Because Marilyn Manson is somewhat about contradiction, So, Every interpretation i've heard is true, Because it's true to the person. We know parts of the story, And ideas behind it, But not everything will ever be fully explained.
Manson intended it that way. Not to confuse people, And to have people sit on a board trying to figure out what other people think it is. He meant for YOU to discover what it means to yourself.
Oh yea, From what we/I know, Adam became Omega because he sold his soul, He sold himself out....basically.
SamuraiKoala32
11-28-2004, 03:52 AM
Originally posted by Coma_Black_8
How come so many people don't know there's a character named Valentine?
Read chaper 10 of Holywood, Which can be found on this site.
Also....I don't think any interpretation is wrong. The trilogy is meant to be a question mark, Because it is art. No one knows everything, No one knows the entire story.
I think every answer is right. Even the ones that contradict themselves, Because Marilyn Manson is somewhat about contradiction, So, Every interpretation i've heard is true, Because it's true to the person. We know parts of the story, And ideas behind it, But not everything will ever be fully explained.
Manson intended it that way. Not to confuse people, And to have people sit on a board trying to figure out what other people think it is. He meant for YOU to discover what it means to yourself.
Oh yea, From what we/I know, Adam became Omega because he sold his soul, He sold himself out....basically.
great point about no one knowing the entire story.
where on this site is chapter 10 of holy wood?
Coma_Black_8
11-28-2004, 11:22 AM
Go to the main page of the site, Then at the top go to Bibliography. At the Holywood novel section, There's a link to chapter 10. Manson gave us Chapter 10 as a Valentines present a long time ago.
Ian_Ball
11-28-2004, 11:47 AM
Originally posted by Coma_Black_8
Oh yea, From what we/I know, Adam became Omega because he sold his soul, He sold himself out....basically.
Yep.
koolboee cdmo87
11-28-2004, 08:52 PM
I've never considered Valentine a character. I know she was a character in that chapter of the HW book that was leaked... but she's barely on the album. Too underdeveloped to really be taken into consideration.
HW needed the book to complement it. He packed too much onto the album, its story is kind of incoherent at times. I understand the basic plot and whatnot, but there's really specific stuff that is just kind of there.
SamuraiKoala32
11-28-2004, 09:52 PM
i really hope the "holy wood" book gets released someday. and soon.
Mr_Hollywood
11-28-2004, 11:50 PM
Yes, I am completely obsessed with the Coma White and Black characters and I wish i could understand them better. If the book came out, it would clear up A LOT of information on the two.
TimothySkold6
11-29-2004, 05:03 AM
Originally posted by Mr_Hollywood
Yes, I am completely obsessed with the Coma White and Black characters and I wish i could understand them better. If the book came out, it would clear up A LOT of information on the two.
Manson likes to keep the fans in the dark
MindRelapse
11-29-2004, 07:53 AM
Hopefully this site can get another interview with Manson and ask him about the book.
SamuraiKoala32
11-29-2004, 03:12 PM
I like your signature, TimothySkold6. Very cool!
Drumstick
12-02-2004, 12:21 PM
Ok that's what i think:
After Adam loses ComaB, his great love, he falls and becomes Omega, only 'cause he meets ComaW, and begins doing drugs
to follow her. He's first drug experience could be described in Disassociative. Than in I Don't Like The Drugs, Omega lets us know that he's really not happy of doin'drugs. Than ComaW has an overdose, and this time all the drugs in this world won't save her from herself (from doing drugs).She dies. For Omega, that's the end. Omega dies (someone here told that on MA tour Omega was killed before ACSS) and becomes a wormboy, someone that cannot understand what's happening around him. He's really sad. But then the anger grows up and up, 'cause he begins to think that someone is against him. Who's ?? That's an hypotethic god.
Ok, so this is the rise of the Antichrist (on ACSS track, at the beginning there is synth stuff. i think simbolizes the caos in wormboy's head--then the heavy intro means the rise of the Antichrist, in fact on LTOE we can hear Manson screaming:"you can't kill me, motherfuckers!!).
Tell me what do you think of.
Everything came
up this morning during my maths lesson. I don't know everything about Valentine and about the fall of the Antichrist (if there is one), 'cause I haven't got the CD.
Sorry for bad english !!
SamuraiKoala32
12-02-2004, 04:03 PM
Originally posted by Drumstick
Ok that's what i think:
After Adam loses ComaB, his great love, he falls and becomes Omega, only 'cause he meets ComaW, and begins doing drugs
to follow her. He's first drug experience could be described in Disassociative. Than in I Don't Like The Drugs, Omega lets us know that he's really not happy of doin'drugs. Than ComaW has an overdose, and this time all the drugs in this world won't save her from herself (from doing drugs).She dies. For Omega, that's the end. Omega dies (someone here told that on MA tour Omega was killed before ACSS) and becomes a wormboy, someone that cannot understand what's happening around him. He's really sad. But then the anger grows up and up, 'cause he begins to think that someone is against him. Who's ?? That's an hypotethic god.
Ok, so this is the rise of the Antichrist (on ACSS track, at the beginning there is synth stuff. i think simbolizes the caos in wormboy's head--then the heavy intro means the rise of the Antichrist, in fact on LTOE we can hear Manson screaming:"you can't kill me, motherfuckers!!).
Tell me what do you think of.
Everything came
up this morning during my maths lesson. I don't know everything about Valentine and about the fall of the Antichrist (if there is one), 'cause I haven't got the CD.
Sorry for bad english !!
that actually sounds pretty good, but how does adam become omega, and how does omega become this "wormboy"?
Drumstick
12-03-2004, 07:49 AM
Becomes Omega with the use of drugs (maybe, today i'll analyze
Mechanical Animals), and become wormboy when ComaW dies, being "unhappy" and really depressed.
DaveMoore
12-03-2004, 12:45 PM
Originally posted by koolboee cdmo87
I've never considered Valentine a character. I know she was a character in that chapter of the HW book that was leaked... but she's barely on the album. Too underdeveloped to really be taken into consideration.
HW needed the book to complement it. He packed too much onto the album, its story is kind of incoherent at times. I understand the basic plot and whatnot, but there's really specific stuff that is just kind of there.
What is the basic plot ?
Is Valentine the vice-president or an secret agent ?
There is more chapters available ?
Coma_Black_8
12-05-2004, 04:06 PM
Originally posted by Drumstick
Becomes Omega with the use of drugs (maybe, today i'll analyze
Mechanical Animals), and become wormboy when ComaW dies, being "unhappy" and really depressed.
I don't think Adam became Omega because of the use of drugs. I think he just resorted to drugs. I think he became Omega because he sold himself out, Sold his soul. It was too late, Because he had already became the king of Holywood. He couldn't escape it. And because of his fame & stuff, He was kinda forced into becoming Omega.
Also, I don't know if Coma White dies. How do you know she dies? I'm not saying she does or doesn't, I have no idea. Manson said MA was the Marilyn side of things, ACSS was the Manson, right? Well Coma White could be like Marilyn Monroe, With the drug overdose at the end of the album. Maybe? I'm just throwing random ideas in the air now. But, I somehow think Coma White, dead or alive, Although he loves her, Makes him angry. I don't know why.
Anyw@y, I'm done rambling.
evilsongwriter
12-07-2004, 01:56 PM
Coma is a personifacation of sedation and drugs, Adam is like the Adam from Bible stories (e.g. Adam and Eve).
koolboee cdmo87
12-07-2004, 05:51 PM
I've never considered Coma Black a seperate character. I think it is just the other (the fragile, insecure) side of the seemingly-perfect Coma White.
Jayne Gacy
12-07-2004, 06:35 PM
umm... you guys seem to be talking about it as if the 3 albums are in their linear forms, like ch1 is acss and ch2 is ma, but it really doesn't seem to be that way to me. i never saw coma black as a separate character, but as a song about coma white. i never saw a character named "valentine". i saw a character named "holy hood." she was a teen who got swept up in the whole adam movement and shot up a dance.
Coma_Black_8
12-08-2004, 12:50 AM
Originally posted by Jayne Gacy
umm... you guys seem to be talking about it as if the 3 albums are in their linear forms, like ch1 is acss and ch2 is ma, but it really doesn't seem to be that way to me. i never saw coma black as a separate character, but as a song about coma white. i never saw a character named "valentine". i saw a character named "holy hood." she was a teen who got swept up in the whole adam movement and shot up a dance.
Holywood is, For lack of words, the perfect place to live kinda.
Death Valley is where the outcasts are.
Drumstick
12-08-2004, 10:27 AM
Originally posted by Coma_Black_8
I don't think Adam became Omega because of the use of drugs. I think he just resorted to drugs. I think he became Omega because he sold himself out, Sold his soul. It was too late, Because he had already became the king of Holywood. He couldn't escape it. And because of his fame & stuff, He was kinda forced into becoming Omega.
Also, I don't know if Coma White dies. How do you know she dies? I'm not saying she does or doesn't, I have no idea. Manson said MA was the Marilyn side of things, ACSS was the Manson, right? Well Coma White could be like Marilyn Monroe, With the drug overdose at the end of the album. Maybe? I'm just throwing random ideas in the air now. But, I somehow think Coma White, dead or alive, Although he loves her, Makes him angry. I don't know why.
Anyw@y, I'm done rambling.
Maybe Comaw not dies really, but for Adam now she's dead (I mean, she's not anything now for him)
spiralion
12-08-2004, 03:30 PM
Adam = Jesus
Coma = Mary Magdeline
Valentine = St. John
Thats all I have for now.
ProdigyOfIcarus
12-08-2004, 04:22 PM
I think Adam/Omega can also relate back to Ziggy Stardust. See, the Ziggy album talks about "Lady Stardust," who was a big fan of Ziggy's song(s) that were played on the radio and he sort of became Ziggy's prodigy. Lady Stardust starts off innocently enough in the Rock and Roll scene. To quothe the song:
People stared at the makeup on his face
Laughed at his long black hair, his animal grace
The boy in the bright blue jeans
Jumped up on the stage
And lady stardust sang his songs
Of darkness and disgrace
Sort of describes Manson a bit, no? So Manson, being a big Bowie fan, could've used this description as sort of an outline for Adam before selling out and becomming Omega, as Adam might have been the big fan of Ziggy. (Hell, I'm considering turning this into a fangirly fanfiction where Adam lives in Sufferegette City before going off to Holywood, etc. etc.) But yeah, by becoming Omega, Adam falls to the same temptations of drugs and sex that Ziggy fell victim to.
Omega also mentions the same end of times that Ziggy sung about and was Ziggy's purpose in coming to Earth: to warn us that we had five years left.
There's a lot more that could probably be expounded upon and such, but I'm much to lazy.
Drumstick
12-09-2004, 01:35 PM
Originally posted by spiralion
Adam = Jesus
Coma = Mary Magdeline
Valentine = St. John
i fucking love that song... i was so sad that i couldn't tickets to a raffi show anytime soon.
how sweet would a manson cover of "bannanaphone" be? lol
DaveMoore
12-10-2004, 03:02 PM
I'll post in the Marilyn Manson Forum an amazing (little) article which Jodorowsky talks about the holy Wood movie , the script ... the story . You all will know why the Disposable Teens are called Disposable Teens in the HolyWood's story (book/album/movie).
Just wait please ... this weekend I'll search in my things .
SamuraiKoala32
12-11-2004, 08:15 PM
Originally posted by DaveMoore
I'll post in the Marilyn Manson Forum an amazing (little) article which Jodorowsky talks about the holy Wood movie , the script ... the story . You all will know why the Disposable Teens are called Disposable Teens in the HolyWood's story (book/album/movie).
Just wait please ... this weekend I'll search in my things .
i'll look forward to it
Coma_Black_8
12-12-2004, 12:52 AM
Same here. =D
DaveMoore
12-13-2004, 11:08 AM
But the problem is that the article is in spanish and my english is not perfect so I ll need the help of somebody who know spanish and english perfectly please ... contact me to my PM if you want to help me .
Thanks
SamuraiKoala32
12-13-2004, 03:20 PM
Originally posted by DaveMoore
But the problem is that the article is in spanish and my english is not perfect so I ll need the help of somebody who know spanish and english perfectly please ... contact me to my PM if you want to help me .
Thanks
i don't know spanish... but would this do the job?:
http://babelfish.altavista.com/
DaveMoore
12-13-2004, 03:26 PM
I ll try it there .
Thanks .
DaveMoore
12-13-2004, 03:40 PM
The traslation isnt working there ...
Komaschwarz
12-22-2004, 07:38 PM
Originally posted by TimothySkold6
Could Valentine be Adams love in Holy Wood, where Omega's(Alien's) love was Coma White in Mechanical Animals
I don't know about ACS
After reading Chapter 10, I'd say no, although nothing is certain until Holy Wood is released.
The only thing that's clear is this: Valentine will have a pivitol role in this novel, he will not be a two chapter character, so to speak.
Valentine seems to be quite the authoritarian, and yet has a brilliant mind. I can't see how this man will not be a central role.
"Hate Sells" - Valentine
EDIT: Valentine most likely will not be Adam's love, considering he is a man. But once again, with Manson, nothing is certain. Don't count on it though.
TERROJA
12-22-2004, 07:42 PM
Originally posted by Komaschwarz
Valentine most likely will not be Adam's love, considering he is a man. But once again, with Manson, nothing is certain. Don't count on it though.
I doubt Adam has a love interest, since the reason Manson didn't go with New Line to produce his Holy Wood feature film was because they wanted him to add in a love interest.
Komaschwarz
12-22-2004, 07:44 PM
Originally posted by TERROJA
I doubt Adam has a love interest, since the reason Manson didn't go with New Line to produce his Holy Wood feature film was because they wanted him to add in a love interest.
Really? Wow...I have all the more respect for Manson now. Although it sucks not having Holy Wood in front of me, I'd rather wait ten extra years for it to surface, than get a packaged product with sunshine, rainbows, and joyful children holding hands under a rainbow.
Good for him.
satanfan
12-23-2004, 10:07 AM
Originally posted by SamuraiKoala32
I was reading through a thread posted by The King in which he requested people's theories on what The Love Song is about (which no one really answered, lol). Anyways, he mentioned something that caught my attention:
I know and love the songs about these characters, but I know nothing about the characters themselves. Actually, it really bugs me but as hard as I try, I can not be analytical. So if anyone could tell me anything about Adam, Coma, and/or Valentine, I would deeply appreciate it.
...or just anything you now about these songs: Coma White, Coma Black, Valentine's Day, The Fall of Adam, The Love Song.
Thanks, friends.
lol
Komaschwarz
12-27-2004, 09:16 AM
Why do people keep speaking of Coma White and Coma Black as though they are people?
That is the most basic, surface value analysis ever. Coma White is a metaphor. Yes Manson does make her out to be a person, but that doesn't change what Coma White represents.
Komaschwarz
12-27-2004, 09:20 AM
Originally posted by Mr_Hollywood
What the hell? I never even knew about this third character, Valentine. Where was he/she/it mentioned?
Coma Black and Coma White, in my point of view, are not the same characters.
Coma Black is Adam's first love, the love that he had an infatuation with and was able to get with. Throughout the course of HW, Adam discovers that she is not all that he thought she was. She was a psychopath, a person who was already on edge. I think she commits suicide ("Her hearts a bloodstained egg/ we didn't handle with care/ its broken and bleeding/ and we can never repair") and the way she looks after she dies ("She was the color of tv")
Coma White on the other hand was a love he found when he finally entered Holywood. Abusive, hardheaded, drug addicted, and beautiful, this was the love that Adam, who's now Omega, thought to be perfect, much better than Black, so perfect in fact that he doesn't feel that he is good enough for her. The fate of Coma White is still unknown to me, although i think she died, and The Boy from ACSS kept the bodies of Coma Black and White and created a fake lover, one made of hair and bone and little teeth, spine is just a string(to attach the body parts with).
1. Coma White and Coma Black are primarily not characters at all, rather they fit the larger landscape of being a metaphor.
2. Pyschopath is a bad analogy. Despite the fact that pyschopaths are clinically sane, Coma has shown periods of great intelligence and forethought
3. Coma White and Coma Black are connected. The Triptych is not a linear formation.
4. This drug addiction you speak of, is once again metaphorical.
EDIT: TRNQT will be much better at explaining this, when he updates the Nachtkabarett :)
SamuraiKoala32
12-27-2004, 02:43 PM
Originally posted by Komaschwarz
Why do people keep speaking of Coma White and Coma Black as though they are people?
That is the most basic, surface value analysis ever. Coma White is a metaphor. Yes Manson does make her out to be a person, but that doesn't change what Coma White represents.
that's why it's called the "interpretations and analyses" forum, and not the "everyone give the correct answer" forum.
"art, to me, is a question mark. i don't think it should ever be an answer"
isn't it also possible that coma could be a person as well as a metaphor, kind of like some characters in "lord of the flies"?
Komaschwarz
12-27-2004, 03:18 PM
Originally posted by SamuraiKoala32
that's why it's called the "interpretations and analyses" forum, and not the "everyone give the correct answer" forum.
"art, to me, is a question mark. i don't think it should ever be an answer"
isn't it also possible that coma could be a person as well as a metaphor, kind of like some characters in "lord of the flies"?
Yes, I'm not doubting any of that, and I agree with you completely in that aspect. I've just noticed that people seem to focus on Coma White as a person, and rarely touch the meaning of her as a metaphor.
spiralion
12-27-2004, 05:34 PM
Originally posted by Komaschwarz
Why do people keep speaking of Coma White and Coma Black as though they are people?
That is the most basic, surface value analysis ever. Coma White is a metaphor. Yes Manson does make her out to be a person, but that doesn't change what Coma White represents. Because, hidden in the booklet of Mechanical Animals it says something like "Is Coma White a real person or just a side effect of the drugs?"
Plus, haven't you read Chapter 10.
And heard untitled?
Komaschwarz
12-27-2004, 05:41 PM
Originally posted by spiralion
Because, hidden in the booklet of Mechanical Animals it says something like "Is Coma White a real person or just a side effect of the drugs?"
Plus, haven't you read Chapter 10.
And heard untitled?
Actually, it reads "I no longer knew if Coma White was real or just a side effect." and if anything, that works to MY advantage as explaining Coma White as a metaphor.
I have read all of Chapter 10, multiple times, but that still does not change the fact that Coma (even in that book) is largely a metaphor.
And yes, I've heard the untitled track off of mechanical animals.
If you listen, you'll noticed he says "and a girl I called Coma White". If Coma White was only a person, and not a metaphor, he'd simply say "and Coma White", but instead of that, he chose the prior option, because Coma is a metaphor.
EDIT: I'm not denying the fact he makes physical embodiments for Coma White, thus making her a real person, however, thats all she is....a physcial embodiment of the message he is trying to convey to us. And we all know that the usage of one image under the guise of another is called a metaphor.
spiralion
12-27-2004, 06:00 PM
Originally posted by Komaschwarz
Actually, it reads "I no longer knew if Coma White was real or just a side effect." and if anything, that works to MY advantage as explaining Coma White as a metaphor.
I have read all of Chapter 10, multiple times, but that still does not change the fact that Coma (even in that book) is largely a metaphor.
And yes, I've heard the untitled track off of mechanical animals.
If you listen, you'll noticed he says "and a girl I called Coma White". If Coma White was only a person, and not a metaphor, he'd simply say "and Coma White", but instead of that, he chose the prior option, because Coma is a metaphor.
EDIT: I'm not denying the fact he makes physical embodiments for Coma White, thus making her a real person, however, thats all she is....a physcial embodiment of the message he is trying to convey to us. And we all know that the usage of one image under the guise of another is called a metaphor. I like your idea of coma in the book as a metaphor. Like as if it were the manifestation of his anima.
SamuraiKoala32
12-27-2004, 07:12 PM
Originally posted by Komaschwarz
Actually, it reads "I no longer knew if Coma White was real or just a side effect." and if anything, that works to MY advantage as explaining Coma White as a metaphor.
I have read all of Chapter 10, multiple times, but that still does not change the fact that Coma (even in that book) is largely a metaphor.
And yes, I've heard the untitled track off of mechanical animals.
If you listen, you'll noticed he says "and a girl I called Coma White". If Coma White was only a person, and not a metaphor, he'd simply say "and Coma White", but instead of that, he chose the prior option, because Coma is a metaphor.
EDIT: I'm not denying the fact he makes physical embodiments for Coma White, thus making her a real person, however, thats all she is....a physcial embodiment of the message he is trying to convey to us. And we all know that the usage of one image under the guise of another is called a metaphor.
that's pretty interesting. good point.
edit: oh, and everyone appears to have a different take on what "coma white" (as a metaphor) represents. what is coma white to you?
SamuraiKoala32
12-27-2004, 07:18 PM
Originally posted by Komaschwarz
Actually, it reads "I no longer knew if Coma White was real or just a side effect." and if anything, that works to MY advantage as explaining Coma White as a metaphor.
where is that hidden? i haven't seen that.
Komaschwarz
12-27-2004, 07:24 PM
Originally posted by SamuraiKoala32
that's pretty interesting. good point.
what is coma white to you?
Many things, but primarily the personification of Holy Wood - I believe she represents a concept that is unobtainable.
I won't write more just yet, until I can think of a way to better vocalize what I mean :/
Komaschwarz
12-27-2004, 07:28 PM
Originally posted by SamuraiKoala32
where is that hidden? i haven't seen that.
You need to use the blue casing that the Mechanical Animals CD came in....and put your booklet under the blue plastic
then, turn to the page that has the lyrics to User Friendly, and under the last of the lyrics is a diagram of someone washing their face.
Put the blue casing over that diagram and the message is revealed.
SamuraiKoala32
12-27-2004, 07:29 PM
Originally posted by Komaschwarz
You need to use the blue casing that the Mechanical Animals CD came in....and put your booklet under the blue plastic
then, turn to the page that has the lyrics to User Friendly, and under the last of the lyrics is a diagram of someone washing their face.
Put the blue casing over that diagram and the message is revealed.
wtf, my casing isn't blue enough. i can read that message, but none of the others. grr.
Komaschwarz
12-27-2004, 07:38 PM
Originally posted by SamuraiKoala32
wtf, my casing isn't blue enough. i can read that message, but none of the others. grr.
I just push it up really hard against all the yellow text. Since I'm a nice guy, I'll write out what I see:
1. "Even machines can see that we are dead."
2. "In the end I became them and I led them
After all none of us really qualified as humans
We were hardworn automatic and as hollow as the 'o' in God
I reattached my emotions cellular and narcotic
From the top of Hollywood it looked like space
Millions of capsules and mechanical animals
A city filled with dead stars and a girl I called Coma White
This is my OMEGA."
3. "A sun with no planets burning in circles."
4. "Now children its time for recess. Please roll up your sleeves."
5. "I no longer knew if Comawhite was real or just a side effect."
6. "www.comawhite.com"
SamuraiKoala32
12-27-2004, 07:48 PM
Originally posted by Komaschwarz
I just push it up really hard against all the yellow text. Since I'm a nice guy, I'll write out what I see:
1. "Even machines can see that we are dead."
2. "In the end I became them and I led them
After all none of us really qualified as humans
We were hardworn automatic and as hollow as the 'o' in God
I reattached my emotions cellular and narcotic
From the top of Hollywood it looked like space
Millions of capsules and mechanical animals
A city filled with dead stars and a girl I called Coma White
This is my OMEGA."
3. "A sun with no planets burning in circles."
4. "Now children its time for recess. Please roll up your sleeves."
5. "I no longer knew if Comawhite was real or just a side effect."
6. "www.comawhite.com"
thank you kindly :)
Hazekiah
12-27-2004, 08:41 PM
Forgot one.
The title "Speed of Pain" (beside the "co51.24ahx") is changed to read "Freed of Pain," as well.
The blue tint of the CD case is a bit weak for its intended purpose, true. The version of the Mechanical Animals vinyl edition which comes with the blue oMEga l.p. works much better...I just hate to use it 'cause it wears down the grooves on the record. :-\
A pair of 3-D glasses works fine...try that instead if you have some handy.
TERROJA
12-27-2004, 08:43 PM
Also, if you look at it under a black light, you can see a picture of Manson sucking Twiggy's dick.
Komaschwarz
12-27-2004, 09:22 PM
Originally posted by Hazekiah
Forgot one.
The title "Speed of Pain" (beside the "co51.24ahx") is changed to read "Freed of Pain," as well.
Sorry there, my bad, I was sort of in a rush, so I just did a quick skim through the book and forgot that more subtly placed tidbit.
Komaschwarz
12-27-2004, 09:23 PM
Originally posted by TERROJA
Also, if you look at it under a black light, you can see a picture of Manson sucking Twiggy's dick.
You know whats pathetic? Despite the fact I knew you were joking, I actually tried it, hehe...
Hellhammer
03-25-2006, 04:50 PM
Originally posted by Coma_Black_8
How come so many people don't know there's a character named Valentine?
Read chaper 10 of Holywood, Which can be found on this site.
Also....I don't think any interpretation is wrong. The trilogy is meant to be a question mark, Because it is art. No one knows everything, No one knows the entire story.
I think every answer is right. Even the ones that contradict themselves, Because Marilyn Manson is somewhat about contradiction, So, Every interpretation i've heard is true, Because it's true to the person. We know parts of the story, And ideas behind it, But not everything will ever be fully explained.
Manson intended it that way. Not to confuse people, And to have people sit on a board trying to figure out what other people think it is. He meant for YOU to discover what it means to yourself.
Oh yea, From what we/I know, Adam became Omega because he sold his soul, He sold himself out....basically. I agree
guillaume
03-26-2006, 10:44 AM
After reading all the replies I must say that I agree about Coma White being a metaphor.
Coma White seems to be Adam`s desire to find someone to love
but after failing Coma White turns Black...
On the chapter 10 Coma White is the daughter of the President,
so, is there a chance that Adam is actually the President`s son?
or maybe a bastard son who`s been sendt to Death Valley
`cause he represented a thread to the President and to Holy Wood...
About Valentine... He might be a conspirator that knows the truth
and ends up helping Adam with his revolution...
bue, well...
We`ll not know anything for sure until the book is released.
S.D.
12-11-2008, 09:20 AM
Relevance to this older discussion may be seen as tenuous, but I have just read that Charles Manson's third son was named Valentine Michael Manson, and born April 1st, 1968.
That happens to be both the date on which all of the audio for Doppelherz was recorded in 2001, and Rozz Williams' suicide in 1998 (as recently noted by dANi 13-34).
It is of course, April Fools' day also.
dANi 13-34
12-11-2008, 09:52 AM
The third Charlie Manson's son got that name, yeah, that's interesting, thumbs up for you, other connections that came up!!!
Coma Alpha
12-11-2008, 11:37 AM
I seen the words "Coma" and "Adam" and thought it was about me for some reason................I'm not awake yet. Sorry.
S.D.
12-11-2008, 12:12 PM
Valentine was the vice president.
In addition to this, the "Secret Service" man mentioned in the tenth chapter of Holy Wood; Westmoreland, is very probably inspired by William Westmoreland.
Westmoreland was the leading General in charge of operations in the Vietnam War from the period 1964-1968, and had fought in the Second World War previously.
Effectively his leadership would have been directly responsible for any operations that Hugh Warner was a part of as I assume he served during those years. Westmoreland was later accused of having ignored the true strength of Viet Cong fighters in order to raise morale, so effectively covering up the details, which is the job that the "Westmoreland" of the book undertakes. In researching for another thread, it should perhaps be noted that the Vice-President for Kennedy was Lyndon B. Johnson, who became President following the assassination. He was responsible for entering a significantly higher volume of troops into Vietnam in the final year of Westmoreland's service there.